Daily Pilots Post: Filling In the Blanks

[cosetteferaud.livejournal.com]

Hi shippers! First of all, thank you very much for all your great thinking and lovely contributions, I am really enjoying being the DPP driver this week. I adore this fandom <3. Well, we have already talked about your K/L favorite moments/scenes, but today I’d like to focus on the extended/deleted scenes… How do you feel about them?

I have always had the feeling that so much juicy piloty material was left on the cutting room floor… In RDM's podcasts we have heard of a lot of scenes that were filmed, but yet many of them had never been seen… For instance, if I remember well, from “The Passage” there was supposed to be a scene after Kara hung up Kat's picture, she turns and runs into Lee's arms and he comforts her. Also, in this episode there was a scene where Kara and Lee sit side by side throwing a ball against the wall and talk about what happened in UB. I wonder if they were actually filmed.

I honestly will never understand why certain scenes weren’t included in their respective aired episodes (hello, K/L TABFAYW scene??). But bitterness aside, I am glad that, at least, we had the chance to see those –I love most of them, and I adore all the awesomeness that was UBEX. So my questions for today revolve around this particular topic:

*Which is your favorite K/L deleted/extended scene? Why?

Given that my favorite pilots moment is the second brig scene, I guess that the extended version of this one is my fave. I love seeing Kara so vulnerable for once (even crying a little), and the picture of Lee giving her the Aurora figurine –the only meaningful token he had from his father-- as the symbol of his faith kills me. It’s very touching and sweet.
Also, even though it breaks my heart into tiny pieces, I really like the TABFYW deleted scene. So well acted and poignant. I believe this was the only time we see Kara being so honest and straightforward in her personal relationships, finally trying to be true to herself ("maybe I'm just cheating myself", gah!).
And I must confess that I have a huge amount of love for the extended “Scar” scene too, when Kara asks Lee if he can picture himself with a wife, a porch swing and a stinky rugrat pissing on his knee. I know it’s not a popular opinion, but I love “Scar” so much.

*Do you consider those scenes canon?

Personally, yes (if they don’t contradict canon, that is).

*Also, which scenes you’d have loved to see?

I guess I have a veeery long list, mainly because I am a greedy shipper and I never had enough of pilots interaction *g*. I think the scene I really, really needed to see is the Kara and Lee’s reunion after the Demetrius story arc. I mean, their farewell was pretty intense and, even though I love their next scene together –that one in Papadama’s office just before they frakked each other senseless on that desk in “Revelations”—, on a narrative level I found it contrived without a previous reunion scene.
Also, another moment I‘d have wanted to see is the beginning of their "fling" –don’t get me wrong, I love the raptor scene and the way we discovered that pilots were having a torrid affair--, but I wouldn’t have minded at all to see how it started. And another one? Well, maybe the moment when Kara met the adorable aberration that was Fat!Lee after the exodus. Can you imagine her reaction? LOL

And, here there is some inspiration for your answers. Discuss! :)

S1 pilots cuteness. Probably one of the most adorable scenes they have together –and the evidence that Lee and Kara shared little routines like jogging every morning.

Extended brig scene. I see this scene as the proof that pilots were far from over at that point –and probably that was the reason why they left the scene out.

TABFAYW extended scene. It's a totally heartbreaking scene, but I wish they'd left the full version of it in the final cut because this is probably the only time Kara actually admits in Lee's face that she loves him more than anyone and should've married him and not Sam. I would really like to know why EJO edited so much out of this scene, since it does add so much to both their characterizations.

"I think things just got more complicated" (UBEX). How much do I adore this one? I really like way UB ends, but this version… I don’t know, it's even more pilots to me, so dysfunctionally adorable (and it’s funny, I feel like it's been so long since I watched pilots… after rewatching all these moments I feel so nostalgic, this scene specifically reminded me of my emotions when I first saw UB and tore me up a little bit).



Comments

[latteaddict.livejournal.com]

Oooh, interesting topic. And I'm just about to go to bed *pout*

The TABFAYW extended scene is interesting in that if you listen to the podcast, RDM says the Kara/Anders scene comes AFTER the Kara/Lee one. So if you take things into their original context, Kara had that epiphany/conversation about wanting Lee and her to be together and she was just cheating herself by denying them before Sam told her to "go to him (Lee)." Which makes it even more of a poignant action that she was choosing Lee under her own steam. She'd had time to think about what he said in the Raptor on the Algae planet and decided Lee was what she wanted, marriage vows and gods be damned. Of course Lee had to go and throw everything back in her face in the most cutting of ways (and it irritates me that it's okay when Lee suggests divorcing Dualla but it's a shitty thing to do if Kara suggests it) which, if we follow RDM's original timeline, is when Kara calls up Sam for sex and then they have their little bunkroom chat. Kara always seems to act out when Lee hurts her so it makes perfect 'Starbuck' sense that she would call up Sam. And it wasn't a happy thing between K/S because Kara was so self-loathing, which is why she called herself a two-timing bitch of a wife. I don't want to say being with Sam was a punishment, but Kara was definitely hurting herself because in her heart she'd wanted Lee. And I guess when Sam asks Kara if she loves Lee, and Kara's all, yes, no, maybe, it fits that she can't flat out admit it because Lee's just turned her down for his adoring little wife and she's too busy having a moment of self hate and licking her wounds.

The whole scene clicked a little better for me when I saw the extended scene and remembered Ron's podcast.

[workerbee73.livejournal.com]

You know, I always saw the K/L confontation scene in TAB as the absolute lowpoint of their emotional tragedy. Lee can't forgive and move past what Kara did on NC, and so he takes it out on her by punishing her and withholding his affection-- and refusing to leave Dee. It's the awful counterpoint to her rejection of him to go and marry Anders. It's so painful and unncessary, but at the same time, the emotions ring true and makes sense, as horrible as they seem.

And the opposite of this emotional devastation? The unwavering love and acceptance and "I don't care" we see from Lee in Islanded. That, my friends, that right there is the peak of their emotional/romantic development. For Lee, that was the culmination of working out his emotional baggage. For Kara, I think it was under the wing in Maelstrom, coming to terms with the fact that she still loved Lee and always would, but was through making demands and trying to control the trajectory of their relationship. A true letting go on both levels. And I really dig the idea that Kara's "betrayal" came first, as did her epiphany/resolution, while Lee took the slower path to get there on both counts.

Damn, I need to write an essay on this....

[daybreak777.livejournal.com]

Lee can't forgive and move past what Kara did on NC, and so he takes it out on her by punishing her and withholding his affection-- and refusing to leave Dee.
Oooh, oooh, ooooh! See, that's kind of what I thought too! Though honestly, I didn't blame Lee. Kara hurt him so bad after they slept together. His face. :-( I mean she went and married someone else, gods.

But I read my friend's commentary (http://community.livejournal.com/vid_commentary/15081.html#cutid1) on a vid of hers once and she knows Lee better than I ever will. It's not that Lee didn't want Kara. It's just that he needed time and Kara moves quicker than lightning on the poor boy and he can't always keep up. And he needed more words from her. I know that was a huge moment for Kara. Huge. But Lee needed a little more.

I love Lee's letting go in Islanded but not Kara's in Maelstrom. It was kind of mature but she was letting go of everything. Now if it had ultimately been for something maybe I could see. But she/we lost Kara there for what? And no, no, no, that's not all they'll ever be. No, Kara. Just, no.

Hee, I like to argue with them. You are just my conduit, WB. :-) I wish I could get college credit or paid for writing essays about them. But, alas . . .

[workerbee73.livejournal.com]

I don't know if the Maelstrom/Kara scene is a perfect exmaple, but by damn it's the only exmaple we have WHILE SHE'S STILL LIVING (Bee is not bitter about this, not one bit) and before she comes back from the dead and vascillates from one extreme to the other before focusing on The Destiny of Magical Song (I'm so not bitter about this either.)

Letting go of everything? Yes at the very end in the viper, but I'm not sure she was at that headspace right there with Lee.

For realz. Peeps could at least send us cookies to keep up our strength whil we undertake these VERY IMPORTANT DISCUSSIONS. : D

[ninjamonkey73.livejournal.com]

Peeps could at least send us cookies to keep up our strength whil we undertake these VERY IMPORTANT DISCUSSIONS.

I request chocolately cookies. Nothing accompanies a good disection of motives quite like chocolate.

[daybreak777.livejournal.com]

In RL I have oatmeal raisin. But here are some virtual cookies and milk. :-)

*munches*

[ninjamonkey73.livejournal.com]

<---- Re: you having an icon of cookies

[mlsky.livejournal.com]

*sends eleventy million dozen homebaked cookies*

[cosetteferaud.livejournal.com]

It's not that Lee didn't want Kara. It's just that he needed time and Kara moves quicker than lightning on the poor boy and he can't always keep up.

I agree. I always thought that Lee rejected Kara out of fear and insecurity. If she had given him the reassurance he needed... But she was so scared, too.

[latteaddict.livejournal.com]

It's the awful counterpoint to her rejection of him to go and marry Anders.

Exactly. But it's a shame that the boxing match and getting to pound out how hurt he was by her betrayal wasn't enough of an absolution. Which makes me wonder what he hoped to accomplish with the affair if he really wasn't willing to forgive her. And if you take it one step further, for all the times Lee offered to give up Dualla (New Cap & Algae planet) TABFAYW was the first time he actually truly contemplated it in real terms and he found out he just couldn't do it and that he really was in love with Dee and needed her, which leads me to conclude that if Kara had gone along with Lee at any time to break from Sam and Dee, Lee wouldn't have been able to go through with it. I mean Lee was a sobbing broken mess at leaving Dee. All this is just spec, of course, but we really only have canon to base our characters hypothetical actions on. I just thought that the reversed scene sequence in TABFAYW was interesting because Kara's actions make much more sense that way instead of what we got.

And I notice someone further down thread says Lee needed to hear more convincing from Kara to accept her offer. But the extended scene shows Kara did in fact say much more to him, she even admitted marrying the wrong guy. What more did Leland need. RDM is evil with his angst cakes!! All these tortured situations between our pilots could've been more tolerable if it had been for some purpose like an actual happy ending or a mutually committed tragic ending but it was angst for the sake of angst and had no purpose other than to create drama.

For Lee, that was the culmination of working out his emotional baggage. For Kara, I think it was under the wing in Maelstrom, coming to terms with the fact that she still loved Lee and always would, but was through making demands and trying to control the trajectory of their relationship. A true letting go on both levels.

Yeah, I guess I'd have to agree with that. But it makes me sad that working out their baggage meant letting go of their romance. All both of them hoped to attain in their respective epiphanies was continuation of their friendship. Both still clearly loved each other, Kara was very transparent with her soft eyes and pining under the Viper wing and Lee had love written all over his face in Islanded, but in those two moments Kara and Lee were letting go, as you say, of their baggage and accepting the relationship for what it was rather than what they wanted. It's all very mature of them, but I admit to wishing they'd never stopped fighting for their passionate love.

You write great essays, Bee. I hope you go ahead and tackle it.

[(Anonymous)]

That's interesting about the order of events, thanks for the info! Sheds more light on why Kara called Sam.
My problem with the TABFAYW scene extended and in the aired version, is not that I don't understand why Lee doesn't quite trust her (Although I wish he'd express this differently, but I guess it's in character for him to get a bit angry, when he doen's quite know how to act). I just don't understand how it seems like he would have trusted her back in EOJ and nothing happened in between to show him she would leave him again.