No Takebacks

Yes, the round robin post was great fun to watch throughout the day. As of this comment, they've just gotten down to the secksing, but we need to give them that sweet release, my dears. RUN over there now and drop a line.

As for my ideal episode. I'd like to see Kara and Lee stuck somewhere away from Galactica and the cylons, teasing, playing, arguing, (and some angst to sweeten the pot), but in the end lots of hot out-making. That would be great! Other, important plotty things with other LESS IMPORTANT CHARACTERS could happen, too, as long as there is lots of hot steamy sex scenes between the boring parts.

Oh, and did I mention, I'd like lots of frakking, too?

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ninjamonkey73.livejournal.com

Um, yes please. ;)

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I feel like I'm going to cause all kinds of drama by saying this--but my ideal episode would not have involve any epic declaration of love or even frakking or anything. I mean, maybe, maybe if the show had been daring in season 2 and got Kara and Lee together and did the "how do we have them make it work" I would think differently.

Would I love to see them make it work? Yes. Would I have liked to see it in the show proper? Probably not.

Do I love the pairing? OH HELL YES.
Do I want the show to focus on it? Eh... not so much.

I remember there was a conversation about how they wished it could've gone differently for them in the finale... or rather what we wished would've been their last scene in the finale or something... and I couldn't think of anything. And then I realized, it was because I didn't want to seem them get together in the finale. I think after this big epic show, for their (especially her) plotlines to conclude with getting together.. I'd feel kind of ripped off. Maybe even more so than the poof. Because "oh boy, after all this, she gets the right man." *sigh* Maybe I'm bitter, but that was bugging me.

Anyways, that being said, I don't know if it's my ideal episode per se, but going back to the idea of "trying to make the relationship work" would be interesting to see work out in an episode. It'd be set right after Scar, before Sacrifice, and eliminate The Captain's Hand from the episode lineup. Since Galactica lost so many pilots while overseeing the tylium operation, several Pegasus pilots are sent over and there're some infighting between the groups due to conflicting philosophies and actually having to live in the same space, leaving Kara and Lee in their roles of Mommy and Daddy of the pilots, trying to work things out. Early in the episode Lee confronts her about the near-frak on the table, she brushes him off, saying it was nothing, maybe laughing it off, I dunno. There's probably a B Plot of some kind going on... don't know what that is... Somewhere towards the end of the episode Kara has a close call, nearly gets blown up in her viper or something, but she's totally fine, but Lee's sort of overcome with relief that she is okay and kisses her on the flight deck in front of everyone. There's probably some CIC scene in here or something related to the B plot. The last scene of the episode, Kara's alone, hitting the punching bag in the gym, when Lee walks up behind her. End episode. Next time we see them is in Sacrifice, in which they both have leave and are attempting to go on a first date together.

Edited Date: 2010-03-27 02:52 pm (UTC)

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Heh. This is funny because it echoes my original (and discarded) post before the one I actually made. I've never really been good at finding a way to put the pilots together that made any sense. No it would not be good if the show was about them. Nah. Wouldn't like that. Part of the appeal, of course, is the incredible angst and pain between them.

I guess if I picked one thing, it would be changing Lee's decision in Taking a Break. That was kinda it for me, the last chance for them to be together. If they decided to be together, there would be lots of room for canon to happen anyway, and for the angst and the death and the pain, but I think that could have worked. They tossed out the essential Starbuck anyway, why not go for the whole frakking thing.

I still stand by my assertion that there should be frakking. That never hurts anything. ;P

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stripes13.livejournal.com

totally with you on the frakking :D

Edited Date: 2010-03-27 03:00 pm (UTC)

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I guess if I picked one thing, it would be changing Lee's decision in Taking a Break. That was kinda it for me, the last chance for them to be together.

I agree... it would take a lot to come back from that and while the brig scene showed some promise the plot didn't allow for it to develop... and by Islanded it was definitely too late.

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Yeah, there was no more room for a lee/kara story once the final five squished out all other plot points. I guess that is the terrible horrible awfulness of the poof -- that would've been the perfect time for them to finally be together. Would that have been so frakking hard?

Anyway, don't mean to ruffle happy pilots space, but sheesh.

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Eah... No I wouldn't have wanted them to get together in the finale. Like I said I don't think a romantic ending at that point would suit.

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Heee. I'm a little obsessed. :P

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If they had a moment of romance earlier in the episode than maybe. But not as it stood

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Oh, but the table was s-o-o-o romantic!! :P

Yeah, couldn't have worked as is. I do like the idea of them going on a first date during Sacrifice. That would've been really great. *sigh*

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stripes13.livejournal.com

Love the ideal episode there. It would absolutely fit in between Scar and Sacrifice.

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Because "oh boy, after all this, she gets the right man." *sigh*

But with all due respect...it wasn't about Kara getting a man, or to walk into the sunset. It should have been about Kara NEEDING LEE. SPECIFICALLY. Because she needed him, and he needed her. And there's nothing wrong with that.

Their whole relationship on the show underlined that need. How they needed each other first as fellow pilots and friends, and to work together and fight together and shepherd the other pilots together, and finally as lovers and support systems. In s4.0 every small moment they had together underlined how much they believed in each other and supported each other and yes, needed each other's love and support. So an ending that didn't pay that off for them, that basically left them okay with parting ways with each other for good, with no hint that they would soon circle back to each other, felt very disingenuous and in direct contrast to what their story had always been.

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Well as I said to sfs they didn't really show that elsewhere in the finale. Yes they showed it in Islanded but the finale as a whole? We had the table scene. If we just got something about needing each other and yes I could buy an ending about them needing each other. But there was no hint of partnership in the finale. It was all on her. In which case ending up with Lee reads strangely. I think the structure of the three hours as a whole would make a romantic ending odd.

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Exactly why that finale (for me) was all kinds of wrong. It turned its back on everything the show had been doing.

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The entire thing needs restructuring. I agree. A lot of it needs changing. See above re: Scar and Sacrifice

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This is an interesting question. I really like the idea up-thread about Kara and Lee being stuck together somewhere and having to actually confront/work out some of their issues. I would have really liked to have seen the alternate idea the writers tossed around for Maelstrom, where Kara and Lee both got trapped beneath the hard deck and were trying to find a way for them both to escape, and they were talking about their issues and Kara finally decided she would sacrifice herself which would enable Lee to live/escape somehow and at the last minute he found a way to save them both.

That would have been a real turning point for them. And Kara would still be human.

ETA: As far as them getting together at the end of the finale, I'll say this. I hated almost everything the finale chose to be, as it seemed like a real turning of the back/throwing up of the hands of all the core things the show had been about. I hated Kara's destiny being reduced to such...coincidence and happenstance and childhood memories and not at all being about what she could accomplish or choose to do with her own free will. (I would have liked a Kara sacrifices herself for the good of humanity a hell of a lot more, believe it or not.) So I wanted Kara to have two things at the end 1)a sense of victory/triumph/accomplishment and 2) peace and happiness in her future. The show's resolution for Kara did not convince me she got either of those, and frankly it felt pasted on. So if they were gonna paste that on, I could certainly live with a pasted on happy ending for Kara and Lee. Would it have been better if they hadn't killed her and had found a way for her to achieve her destiny as a real flesh-and-blood human? Of course, and then it wouldn't have been impossible to write a real arc for Kara and Lee where they got together in a logical fashion. Because let's face it, Lee should have seen the light when Kara returned. That's what Romo's speech was about and instead they shuffled him off to quorum and put distance between them as much as possible. Silly decisions.

Edited Date: 2010-03-27 05:40 pm (UTC)

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cherylad.livejournal.com

I don't want to go to deep here (cuz the rage lies this way), but I think Daybreak was written in a complete vacuum to the rest not only the season but the entire show. It is what it all felt so false for me. I can't find an edit for it - it just needed to be trashed and a completely different episode put in there.

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Yeah, I kind of agree. (The rage! It flares up every now and again like bad arthritis!)

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cosetteferaud.livejournal.com

where Kara and Lee both got trapped beneath the hard deck and were trying to find a way for them both to escape, and they were talking about their issues

I like this. Something I really wanted and we never got was a meaningful conversation between them. I wanted them to actually talk about them and their feelings for once (and the perfect sceneario for that was a life-or-death situation, imo). There were so many words left unsaid between them in the end, it was a shame.

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ecstaticdance.livejournal.com

My ideal episode would be one that moved the story forward, both on a large scale, and within the frame of reference of the characters in the episode. One that honored where they'd been and the heart of the story (i.e. - the survival of humanity and the inherent strength found in hope, trust and love). I don't care so much who's in it. I don't care about the sex (though I wouldn't mind it between certain characters ;))... I just want things to add up and the characters to be respected.

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cherylad.livejournal.com

I so agree.

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rachelindeed.livejournal.com

I am definitely in the "wanting to see them work it out" camp, but if that was ever going to be effective storytelling it needed to happen in bits and pieces in the background of the Galactica story rather than in the-dramatic-get-together episode or the-angry-breakup episode (or even the-happy-ending-out-of-nowhere episode we never got). I think what made me believe they would be wonderful together was the way they shared chemistry when their relationship wasn't remotely the focus of the scene: doing their jobs, hanging out in groups, being in non-romantic situations and still sparking off each other, being comfortable with each other. I think if they had worked things out, their romance would have felt a lot like their friendship. In fact, when I think of the scenes we actually got on the show that worked like that, they are usually small moments in episodes focused elsewhere:

- The scene in Hand of God where Kara disses Lee's strategy for being textbook and ineffectual. The reason I love this little moment is that you could hear in Lee's voice when he presented the plan that he didn't really believe in it himself, and when he responds to Kara, a little piqued, you can hear both the challenge and the openness in his voice: "OK. So what would you do differently?" For similar reasons, I love Lee's: "At ease. So what's the plan?" in KLG Part II and Kara's "You wanna hear what I think happened, or not?" in Captain's Hand. They just listen to each other, no matter what else is going on with them, and that's - for me - romantic.
- Lee's "pull up a pew" to Kara in their triad circle, and the way he intuited the situation with Baltar in 0.5 seconds with no words at all. The little teasing elbow-bump in the extended "Scar" drinking scene, or the way Kara taps his shoulder when she likes his attitude in their Blackbird exchange in "Pegasus." Those little casual, non-getting-it-on touches are the best part, they're just unconsciously intimate, and that's what I want to see.
- Kara's "you're the worst CAG in the history of CAGs" and "Can I be a suspect again. Please?" Lee's "It's our favorite time of day again" and annoying singing to get her going in the morning. The little scene at the podium in "A Day in the Life" when she admires his butt-kicking CAG sermon and he just looks at her, and there is *nothing* about this episode or situation that should be sparking lightning between them but it is so there.

I wanted a series full of those moments; I wanted them to be in love like that :) Best friends with benefits. And yes, angst would happen, because they are both messed-up and also because that's life, but I wanted to see them build a strong enough romantic relationship that they could let their problems blow over the same way they did in their professional lives and in their friendship.

And I didn't enjoy seeing them cheating on other people or using other people while angsting over each other. I wanted their love to make them better human beings, I wanted them to be each other's conscience or critic or comforter or ally or occasional enemy, and to see that their influence on each other was more beneficial than destructive. Not all the time, but most of the time.

Anyhow, that's less an ideal episode than an ideal series, but why not think big? :)

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