DPP: Daybreak

[lizziec]

Monday's DPP was Celebrations. We have lots of prompts, and one lovely ficlet by kballgetlost. Please go leave some love in the form of reviews :)

Tuesday was pilots picspam day, and there are some glorious pilots moments. Stop by and revel in the pilot-y joy.

Yesterday was Interventions - some really interesting points of intervention in pilots relationship came up :)

Today we're looking at Daybreak. I know, I'm really sorry to do this to you...

Yesterday Mark Does Stuff finished watching allllll of BSG, so I thought this would be a good time to revisit how we see events in Daybreak - and how we saw them when we first watched it. Included under the cut are some of the things that Mark says about our pilots in his Daybreak reviews to get us started (please note, this is not an excuse to get personal, just a way for us to talk about how each of us feel about the ending based on what someone else thinks).

Mark Watches Daybreak Part I

On faith in people and what Kara needed to hear:

I think the first sign that I should have a box of tissues ready was when Adama told Starbuck that he did know what she was: his daughter. Like Lee’s statement before, it’s unconditional love for her, and it’s something that she needed more than anything else.

Mark Watches Daybreak Part II

On the flashbacks:

Part two opens with flashbacks, and in a weird way, it was like another reminder that these characters’ stories were coming to an end. It’s not like this whole goddamn episode didn’t do that, but I realized that this would probably be the last time I’d see Adama and Tigh drunk together. (Side note: Tigh drunk screaming will never not be the most hilarious thing this show has ever produced ever. Which is perfectly fine, by the way, because I love the inclusion of humor that we see here. MORE ON THAT IN A SECOND.) This was the last time I’d see Starbuck and Lee make poor choices in a relationship and awkwardly flirt with one another. This was the last time I’d see Roslin diving headlong into an uncomfortable situation just for the hell of it. This was the last time I’d see Adama in the gutter, looking up at the stars. (OH GOD AN OSCAR WILDE REFERENCE, holy fuck I love this show.)

On Romo becoming president:

But before I could get any sadder, the episode cuts to Lee making Romo Lampkin THE FUCKING PRESIDENT. I’m sorry, this is SO GODDAMN FUNNY TO ME. I mean, what could be more irritating for the man than having to be President? Lee, you are a genius and I love you for it forever.

On not telling Boomer "the plan":

I was thankful for Starbuck’s retort about not telling Boomer “the plan” because it broke the painful awkwardness at just the right moment.

Mark Watches Daybreak Part III

On the blind jump to the Watchtower co-ordinates:

And then Adama orders Starbuck to make a blind jump, and then my entire brain collapses from what transpires from this order. Those notes that made no sense to her or to Cavil turn out to work perfectly as FTL coordinates. (No, seriously, this blog entry has made me love Bear McCreary from now until the universe ceases to be.) I honestly adore how this jump comes with sets of flashbacks: we see her find her body on Earth. We see Leoben call her an angel. We see her tell Lee Adama that she thinks about death every time she gets into the cockpit. We see her claim that her biggest fear is being forgotten. So I started to wonder if any of this were true, or if Kara Thrace had found a way to be remembered.

On Kara's end:

Lee and Kara follow Adama as he carries Roslin to his Mark II, and three of them exchange bizarrely-coded goodbyes. Adama knows what takes Lee a few moments to admit: This is the last time they’ll see him. And so his greeting to Starbuck is a reference to something they’ve said all along, and she knows it’s goodbye. As they wave goodbye to Roslin, the scene focuses on Lee and Starbuck, and it’s here that the one major question left for season four is addressed: Starbuck’s identity.

When she tells Lee she’s not coming back, that she feels satisfied that she’s completed something that needs to be done, she questions Lee: What is he going to do with the rest of his life? I was touched that he decided that he didn’t want to just exist and rest and relax; he was on a new world, and that new world inspired a sense of discovery and desire in him, something he’d not experienced in a while. And then he turns to find that Starbuck has simply ceased to exist. I gasped, and then immediately felt so goddamn satisfied by that image of Lee standing amongst the green, waving grass blades in the field. In that one moment, “Maelstrom” was given the weight and emotional force it had when I first watched it. Kara “Starbuck” Thrace’s actions had a consequence, and her death was real and had meaning. There was no shitty retconning of that plot, there was no attempt to deny her agency or free will, and there was no denial of her experiences in season four. They were still real, she still affected people and the fleet, and whatever “power” sent her back to direct those people to Earth never bothered to intervene and control her. She did what she was “destined” to do, and after saying goodbye in her own way to Lee Adama, she was gone.

The truth is that I don’t want to know the details of who she was. I know others do, and I accept that. We want different things from the show. I hate comparing this show to LOST (though the similarities in their series finales are eerily obvious to me), but mythology only matters so much. I want closure on the characters, and Starbuck’s disappearance gives me that. If she was really an angel, spelling that out would have made me feel disappointed. It would have felt cheap and easy.

So what do you think? Does any of it mesh with how you saw the ending, or even still see it? Has your view of Daybreak changed over time? How?



Oh god, my poor poor heart

Comments

[word-vomity.livejournal.com]

It seems you have given into the rant that I was trying to resist. *pets you*

because Lee and Kara made a poor decision under the influence--they do not deserve to be together (because, yeah, that one poor decision is so much worse than EVERYTHING ELSE OTHER PEOPLE HAVE DONE?!

I know. It's sad. EVERYONE got endings! EVERYONE! Even if they hurt, they got actual endings. But not pilots.

But no affection? No anything except in flashbacks? Nothing. No begging her not to leave or a hug or anything? And then POOF. She just disappears? HOW DOES THAT INSTILL SATISFACTION IN ANYONE? I ASK YOU! All it instills in me is deep depression, frustration that my favorite character is a gaping plot hole, and the unshakable notion that Lee goes and climbs his mountain--only to jump off of it when he gets to the top.

Try not to think about it too much. That way lies only rage and sadness.

Here try this . . .

Pilots in a field on Earth.

Lee: My first memory of my father is watching him fly away on a big plane and wondering when he'd be coming back. He's not coming back this time.

Kara: Maybe he will. He can't grieve forever, Lee.

(skipping Kara's crap about being done with journeys)

Kara: So what about you? What are you gonna do? (skip stupid line about 'today is the first day of the rest of your life' cuz BARF!)

Lee: I always thought after this I'd kick back, relax, spend the rest of my days doing the absolute minimum possible.

Kara: And now that you're here?

Lee: I wanna explore! I wanna the climb mountains, I wanna the cross oceans. Gods, I can't believe I'm saying this. It sounds so exhausting. I must be crazy.

Kara: *laughs* Well, we can't have you running off playing explorer all alone. Guess I'd better come along. You could use someone who knows what they're doing out there..

Lee: *smiles knowingly* My hero.

Kara: You know it.

They both look out at small hill behind them.

Lee: Race you to the top?

She's already running. He chases after her.

Lee: Cheater!

[useyourlove.livejournal.com]

[I'm warning for generalized rants and slight off-topic ramblings. This show gives me FEELINGS. And not all of them are completely tied in to Kara and Lee. Also, I ranted so much I need to split this into two comments *headdesk* SORRYYYYY.]

*is petted* I never pass up an opportunity to rant about this finale. Sometimes television finales are great. Sometimes they suck. Sometimes they don't exist. If they do exist they all have their flaws (I'm thinking of the obvious in-universe liberties taken in BtVS, but those work because they're part of a deliberate metaphor and further serve to strengthen the overarching theme of the show itself). But this? There is not one single bit of this that's logical. The only bits I like are sending Galactica off in a blaze of glory (although the battle itself is extremely "WTF"--I'm not even going to go there right now since that's fairly off topic for this comm) and the fact that Gaius Baltar gets to give his giant eloquent speech in CIC. I love Gaius most when he's a skeezbag and a sleezball and I missed his eloquent ass-saving speeches. Gaius' "religion" is so so humanistic and empowering at some points and then it's like a different writer gets a hold of it and it turns back into "THIS IS AN OBVIOUS STAND-IN FOR CHRISTIANITY." I just want to mash the keyboard in rage at this ending.

What amuses me the most is how ok with it I was to begin with. What also amuses me is how I would forgive the finale everything--every innanity and nonsensical non sequitur--if it gave me even a smidgen of closure with Kara, and Kara and Lee. YOUR ENTIRE FOUR SEASONS OF TUMULTUOUS RELATIONSHIP LEADS UP TO THAT? I also tend to hate this episode because of how many ship wars it gets me into. "Oh, she loved Sam more. See." WTF. a.) she always gets hung up on dead guys, and only after they're inaccessible does she become committed to them. Why? Because they can't in any way hurt her that way. Girl has serious commitment issues. b.) the first time she tells Sam that she loves him is like twenty minutes before the end of the entire series. c.) THIS IS ONE EPISODE. Your five minutes of genuine affection in one episode does not negate my hours upon hours of complicated, subtle, screwed-up rightness. d.) [then my impulse to choke people through the internet kicks in and I lose all other rational thought]. I don't understand how anybody can say she loves Sam more than Lee after UB (although this is, yet again, a completely off topic discussion that I should steer away from BUT I CAN'T). I continually suspect that this has to do with Sam being their favorite character. Kara is way way too complex to boil down to nothing but her romantic relationships which is something I think most K/L shippers are good at not doing (then again it's our ship that has the most complexity inherent in it, so we see more of Kara--even through a romantic lens--than most).

[useyourlove.livejournal.com]

And yes. Your ending is way better. I don't understand what purpose it serves to have them not be together except that the writers and producers apparently took absurd levels of glee in never allowing them to be together. It doesn't actually make sense to deny them their ending in this case. It's just like they got to that point while writing and were like "wait, this is looking too happy. MAKE HER DISAPPEAR." I do love how Lee makes a move in the actual ending like he's going to hold her close and never let her go and she does this little hitch backstep like "if you touch me I won't leave and I know I have to so please don't." Then again, the finale sends so many mixed messages about everything that I guess the message could also be "don't touch me, I don't love you." Though that contradicts everything else we've seen for four seasons a mini series and a movie. In fact, hey, everything else about Daybreak does too.

I'm coming to be of the opinion that they made the ending so terrible just so we'd still be talking about it now. And so we'd still be writing fic about it now. It was like the finale was for the network and the casual fans to say "ok, here's a moderate amount of closure. This is the best we could come up with. If you don't like it, go write your own." Which we all vehemently do. Every time I finish this show the only thing I want to do is start it over and relive the amazing (because, honestly, I'm on my third rewatch and every time I finish I start again within three days.) And I drag all of my friends into watching it as well. I feel a little bad about that though, because I feel like the show misrepresents itself in the context of the finale. I'm like "WATCH THIS WITH ME IT'S AMAZING." And then they watch it, and agree, and we love it for as long as it takes us to finish. And then at the end I just feel bereft. I always feel like I've betrayed my friends' trust by making them watch something so good and then the ending being that. It makes me feel like a bad person. I do not like that my favorite show makes me honestly feel like a bad person. Because Season One: Politics and Hyper-Realism... in Space! ("yay!") Season Two: More Politics and Hyper-Realism... in Space! ("yay!") Season Three: Soap Opera... in Space! ("ilu guys so much that I don't care--GIVE ME MOAR.") Season Four: Crazy Religious Mysticism... IN SPACE!!! (".............wtf???") (And can I just say how bitter I was to find out that Earth 1.0 wasn't our Earth? I loved the thought that we had had a technological singularity that lead to nuclear destruction of the humanity. What a dark and dire warning to send! It was brilliant and fit in with the tone of the show perfectly. But then, we get our crappy sappy lame-ass second (or third or fourth or fifth??) chance to make it all work out? I mean, I'd say up through 4.0 is serious quality. Up through Gaeta's mutiny is serious serious quality. After that it gets iffy.)

[word-vomity.livejournal.com]

I do love how Lee makes a move in the actual ending like he's going to hold her close and never let her go and she does this little hitch backstep like "if you touch me I won't leave and I know I have to so please don't"

Oh God! That is my favorite moment of that scene. His face! Her face! SO MANY FEELINGS! Mabye the writers should have just left out all dialogue and let Jamie and Katee just sell the shit outta it. Haha.

I always feel like I've betrayed my friends' trust by making them watch something so good and then the ending being that. It makes me feel like a bad person. I do not like that my favorite show makes me honestly feel like a bad person.

THAT to me is HILARIOUS! Because basically anytime you try to convert anyone to the BSG koolaid, you're pretty much saying, "Hey, come spend 4 season getting your heart torn apart and your soul shredded! It's awesome!" Lol, and it IS awesome, but also, wrenching. I must admit, no one I've converted has turned into a Kara/Lee shipper yet *cries forever* so I don't feel SO bad about shepherding them into the doomed fold.

Basically, if you still feel ragey, feel ragey. It's OK. It speaks to the level of your love for them.

[useyourlove.livejournal.com]

The person I'm currently converting is apparently an Adama/Roslin shipper--and we're on episode five (I don't even know). I also had to explain to her what shipping even was. But she has made comments to the effect of "oh, they are so hot for each other" and "tell me they get it on in the next episode" in regards to Kara and Lee. I'm working on her (it possibly helps that I cannot contain my levels of squee.) Why I want her to feel this pain, I'm not entirely sure. BUT SHE MUST. (Also I won't feel quite as stupid crying so much if she's as invested in it too. Lol.)