No Takebacks

I guess so....

**feels moderately better**

I just.... it's the one episode that just makes me feel embarrassed for everyone involved. : /

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aurora-0811.livejournal.com

Mockery and Alcohol is the only way to get through it. You can do both with mute on as well. Insert your own dialog....oh wait, it would probably be an improvement over the actual episode.

Did I mention the Alcohol?

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I think we should rewrite the dialogue whilst under the influence. It can be like a cracktastic liveblog.

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rayruz.livejournal.com

I'm all for mockery and alcohol on the grounds of doing mockery and alcohol for Scar as well. I spent like half an hour (maybe more) discussing with my friend how that episode just went horribly horribly HORRIBLY wrong. In terms of how it has zero thematic flow.

Unpopular fandom opinion: Black Market > Scar

Just saying.

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Can I just say that I don't like either ep?

**ducks**

Seriously, in my little pea brain I'd rather just skip the back half of 2 and go straight to season 3. I'm just not a fan of this whole stretch of episodes (and I think the K/L stuff got way overwrought. Much moreso than QoD. But I'm probably the only one who thinks that.)

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rayruz.livejournal.com

Well I really like Sacrifice and love Downloaded and like LDYB (specifically the last 20 minutes of it. Am I a freak for how much I love the NC arc? Probably.)

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I'm not a fan of any of the cylon focused episodes. Call me prejudiced but I wanted for the survival of the humans, not the machines.
I thought they were far more interesting when they were mysterious.

But, little did I know I was going to watch for 5 years to find out the showrunner was all about the attackers.

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Hello BSG twin! This is where BSG and I ultimately parted ways. I liked the story about the small remnants of humanity who were trying to figure out how to survive and how to *live* and IMO, there were tons of storylines possible there. They never really explored the concept of survivors' guilt or, as we discuss below, the very real logistical problems. (Seriously, you could probably have structured an entire episode around people having to wear other, dead people's clothes, because there wasn't anything *else.*) SIGH! Instead, I got bombarded with messages about how the Cylons were really *JUST LIKE THE HUMANS* and ... I didn't care about the Cylons that much. Ever. I mean, I love Colonel Tigh, and that's pretty much it :P

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*Twin*!

Me too ... Chief & Tigh had me at hello, but I seriously couldn't have cared less about the rest of them and the ONLY thing I liked about the finale were Racetrack playing a major plot role even after she was DEAD and Tory finally getting hers.

There was so much left un-mined that would have been incredibly compelling, but it was like the show read its own media and decided that it would be edgy to make the Nazis the good guys - just mislead and misunderstood, really.

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rayruz.livejournal.com

I mean, as far as I see it the cylons are kind of the whole point and I love that my opinion of the cylons changed as the show went on. I mean, my favorite thematic thing was "the other" and villainizing what we don't understand but wait... if we understand it they're not so different from us... very allegory for the times and I love it.

I swear, my opinion of Ellen really strongly shows how I felt about the cylons... which like...when she first appeared I was all "Oh, I hope she's a cylon. She's so annoying!" then by like... late season 2 I was like "I don't want her to be a cylon. She's not cool enough to be a cylon." And then come 4.5 I was like "Oh my god! Ellen's a cylon! She's suddenly super hot!"

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Heh! Well, on the plus side, Lee is ridiculously good-looking in "Black Market." Also, as ideas go, it wasn't a bad one; it just failed in the execution. I kind of always wanted to rewrite it and fix the plot problems (like, where are all the booze and shiny clothes coming from and shouldn't people be thinking more about FOOD and why is cash still being paid for any sort of transaction instead of ... and so it goes!) I think "Lee Adama, Film Noir Hero" could actually work nicely IF DONE RIGHT!

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Me too, but it all went so horribly wrong....

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ecstaticdance.livejournal.com

I agree with this statement.

The Black Market thing had to be addressed, and I really think that having Lee address it was a good way to show a little more of the complexity of his character.

I don't love Black Market, but I do see the potential and I like what I think they were trying to do.

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I think it would have worked much better if they'd focused on the whole antibiotics thing more (and had the bad guy be more Harry Lime in "The Third Man"). Adding in the child pr0n aspect of the whole thing just muddied the waters and made it stupid - seriously, among 40K survivors of genocide, were there really *that* many perverts? REALLY?

And having Lee's unnamed girlfriend make a sudden appearance and then disappearance also made no sense. I could even (stretch) to see him going to a hooker - rather than taking up what I'm sure many ladies would have been happy to offer for free - because he didn't want any commitments but ... the rest. IDK! It was stupid; at least mention the girlfriend before, or have her in some context when he was dying OR SOMETHING. (Although I madly love Baltar's and Lee's confrontation in Fisk's quarters as it is HILARIOUS!)

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Agreed, the child porn thing was ridiculous because if THAT was the real survivor pool of humanity? Nuke them all.

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Agreed, the child porn thing was ridiculous because if THAT was the real survivor pool of humanity? Nuke them all.

Heh! I wasn't even thinking on moral grounds about who deserved to live, just that it's statistically improbable that there could be that many people with such a specific proclivity as survivors of the disaster and therefore, I find it improbable that there could have been a market of that size for child slaves.

Of course, the whole antibiotic story was MUCH more interesting because that actually *was* something everyone might have needed and that a military ship could have provided, etc. (Seriously, have none of the BSG writers ever watched the classic "Third Man"? ALL ABOUT ANTIBIOTICS! And it's gripping stuff!) Also, Lee's moral ambiguity would have been significantly upped if he'd shot someone in cold blood because they diluted or withheld lifesaving drugs rather than shooting someone who was in charge of a child prostitution ring. There's very little ambiguity in the latter action.

*still bitter that the Lee episode sucked so much*

And arrrgh, I REALLY want to re-do this right :P

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True that, the stats part. It just frustrated the heck out of me that of all the "issues" they could have gone for they went for the so-obvious-one.

I like yours MUCH better and would have been both plausible and relevant rather than going directly for the heart-strings.

And yes... they totally boffed Lee's epi. I think it is yet another example of the writers not having a clue how to write for a very complex male hero who wasn't just a dumb jock.

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like, where are all the booze and shiny clothes coming from and shouldn't people be thinking more about FOOD and why is cash still being paid for any sort of transaction instead of ... and so it goes!)

From the "Mall of the Colonies Ship" and the "Magical Factory Ship" that we never saw. They always jumped in the middle when we were watching the viper action.

*snort*

Edited Date: 2010-02-16 07:01 pm (UTC)

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Okay, I know I'm alone in this, but it was "Black Market" that made me find my Lee-love. I mean other than the obvious, OMG!Lee!Hawt! It made him real and human for me. Much like UB made me Love/Want to Smack/Want to Hug Kara.

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Heh! Agree on the latter - UB helped me rediscover my Kara-love which took several body blows late in season 2 and early in season 3! And I actually find "Black Market" less obnoxious than "The Woman King" which wasn't even an interesting concept badly done, but was just BAD!

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YES! WK was horrendous .. and Dirty Hands was not on my list of favs either, though, I do like the concept. I think my biggest problem was watching Adama wander all over the ship with his dead ex-wife's voice in his head and then he STILL shut down Lee after opening the conversation. *argh*

Although, him wandering having conversation with her was better than he and his toothbrush in 4.5. *headdesk*

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