DPP: Tragic Love Stories

[winegums.livejournal.com]

Today's question is as follows - would we love pilots as much as we do if they'd been a couple who hadn't got themselves royally screwed over by cosmic bad luck (a.k.a. the perversity of Ronald D. Moore)? To make a little more sense of the above question, I guess I should rephrase it: would we still care as much as we do about pilots, or be as active as we are here in trying to remember the good bits and lamenting the bad ones and imagining the what-could-have-beens, if the show had left them in a good place two years ago? (i.e. together). Or even if it had given them any clear resolution at all?

I don't honestly think that pilots would have been any less epic and heart-wrenching and beautiful if Kara hadn't been forced to go poof in that field. But in the past, I've found that leaving characters - not just romantic pairings - in a happy place often means I find it easier to metaphorically lay them to rest, so to speak, especially when there was a very real fear that they could end their story in a bad way (like Harry Potter. Or Buffy. Or the entire cast of Firefly, who very definitely did not all get happy endings but at least had what felt like an ending to that particular part of their story). And that just didn't happen with Lee and Kara in BSG. So what say you, people? Are we (at least in part) driven to fandom action by the fact that pilots got a raw deal in canon, or am I just out of my tree?

Comments

[scifishipper.livejournal.com]

Impossible to say of course, but I remember watching Farscape and feeling initially excited to pursue fanfic, but in the end, when they got their happy ending, I didn't feel compelled. There was nothing to fix. I didn't even bother to read any fanfic, although I had been excited about it.

Does that mean I wouldn't have gone nutso over pilots, not necessarily, but it is an interesting parallel. Almost two years later, I've stopped trying to fix canon and am now satisfied taking our beloved characters and putting them into non-canon places. That is so fun and satisfying. I love the BSG world and do stay inside it, but soon, I imagine I'll branch off from that and go even more AU. Then back around again? We'll see...

[kag523.livejournal.com]

I am so excited by this: soon, I imagine I'll branch off from that and go even more AU... This is totally leaving me grinning. You are SUCH a talented writer. I cannot WAIT to read more from you! *pulls you to dance* K :>D

[shah-of-blah.livejournal.com]

Well, I was active in fandom well before the end, and I definitely thought they were going to end up together. Didn't deter me in the slightest from ficcing it up.

Would fandom today be different? Probably, yes. Maybe some people never would have joined. But there were other people who left fandom because of the crappy ending. So I don't think I can really say anything other than 'it would be different' and leave it at that. I'd still be here, anyway.

[callmeonetrack.livejournal.com]

What she said. ;)

It's hard to conjecture. I think their story actually completely required a happy ending because of the way it was introduced and built, and it will always really gall me that they dropped the ball on that. But...I rewatched some episodes yesterday (Colonial Day, Home 1 & 2, Captain's Hand) and... it occurred to me that although the ship looms so large for me, subsuming pretty much everything else about the show, it was really just a small faction of the show itself. Even in very pilots-heavy episodes like those! They are larger than life for me because of FANDOM not Canon. So...I don't know. I think I would still want to read and write stories about them, but if fandom was even less active than it is now because of a happy ending? That'd be hard to keep doing. Other people's excitement fuels MY excitement often.

[daybreak777.livejournal.com]

They are larger than life for me because of FANDOM not Canon.
I totally agree. It was reading all of the fic that really pushed it over the edge for me. I don't think we can chicken or egg it. We can't unsee the fannish goodness. :-)

Great fic is made from unresolved stories. But great fic is also made from well-written characters, well-written canon plots, and two leads with undeniable chemistry . I don't think completely happy K/L fans would less active, least not because of being happy. I think activity naturally drops off after a show ends. Still, it's an interesting question!

[kag523.livejournal.com]

I have to say how amazing it is to have people like you - who have been here since the beginning - still active in fandom. I love that! :>D

[shah-of-blah.livejournal.com]

hahaha...we have not been here since the beginning. but i appreciate it anyway!

[rachelindeed.livejournal.com]

I agree that it's finding other people who share your excitement and continue fueling you with their imaginings that keeps a fandom going. For me personally, I don't think it has much to do with whether the characters themselves got a happy or satisfying ending. I write about Kara and Lee, but also Snape (unhappy but satisfying ending) and Holmes and Watson (happy and satisfying, I suppose, in that there really is no ending). If I love the character, I enjoy writing and reading about them, and there are usually spaces to fill in almost any story, no matter how satisfyingly told. I usually move on from focusing on a particular character when I've said/read my piece or when other people stop reading/being interested, but I almost always circle back to the characters again later when I'm in the mood and new creative stuff has had a chance to build back up in fandom.

[cosetteferaud.livejournal.com]

Well, I always suspected that Kara and Lee weren’t going to get a conventional happy ending, but I thought it would be emotionally satisfying somehow --which of course it wasn’t. But aside their ending (and the fact that I clearly have a soft spot for doomed couples), the most compelling thing about pilots (and what brought me to fandom in the first place) was their relationship and their journey together (and apart). I just love these characters so much and I guess that’s why I am still here after all this time (or sort of, given that I am mostly in a lurker mode these days).

[winegums.livejournal.com]

Yes, in S4.5 I had the feeling things weren't going to end happily for them either, but I agree COMPLETELY that for me, my love of pilots was more about the journey and not so much the destination.

It's enough for me that they became people who loved each other and (as of Daybreak) wanted to be together, the pain of the poof cannot be undone but there's some very, very small consolation to be had in the moment they shared before the end - and for that I'm grateful.

Okay, I'll play devil's advocate...

[kag523.livejournal.com]

Um... well I'm just going to step outside the box here and admit that if Kara and Lee had gotten their happy ending, I wouldn't be here at all. I never would have read a word of fanfic (as I never did before). I never would have written a single fic myself (as all my writing prior to this was RL writing) and I never would have met any of YOU. And thought that's sad. It's true. So I'll admit to this odd fact: I'm GLAD (despite my grief over the ending) that the ending left so MUCH to be desired.



Now, have I found resolution with BSG since then? Yes, actually, I have. And I've found it for ALL the characters. I really do love them all. For Kara, in particular, I've come to see the ending as what it was meant to be (at least in my perception.) I have no hatred of it anymore... though it took me a year to actually get to this point. Have I lost the desire to write since reaching it? No. I'm still here. I still write lots (though as much of that is RL coping as anything else.) And I still love visiting with you all and being part of this writing community. I also LOVE the stories that are still being created. In a way, I think that the JOY of that awful *poof* is that we are forced to create our own ending. And there's something to be said for that.

Anyhow. I guess that's where I am. *shrugs*

And now, a gif, just because I happen to love it. K :>D

(http://s931.photobucket.com/albums/ad159/kag523/Gifs/?action=view&current=15karaspittingscar.gif)

Re: Okay, I'll play devil's advocate...

[rachelindeed.livejournal.com]

So glad you took their lemons and made lemonade, bb! <3 <3 <3 <3

Re: Okay, I'll play devil's advocate...

[kag523.livejournal.com]

Thank you, R. Meeting YOU and getting to read your amazing writing is one of the many reasons I'm grateful for the ending being what it was. You ROCK! K :>D

Re: Okay, I'll play devil's advocate...

[winegums.livejournal.com]

I'm on the same page with you when it comes to finding peace with the poof - at the end, on an emotional level, I've come to the conclusion that it's enough for me that they were two people who really loved each other and that Kara wanted to be with Lee at the end (implied by Kara's expression and very obliquely by Katee herself recently). To me, it wasn't about the destination so much as how they got there, and even if it took a few writing turns for the illogical (plot device marriages invested with way more significance than they should have had), it was beautiful.

[ddt73.livejournal.com]

For me it did drive me out of fandom for awhile, as I went away from fandom for awhile. It was just my love for these two and the people in the fandom that brought me back.

[kag523.livejournal.com]

*hugs*

Your video archive is an amazing homage to both pilots and to KS and JB too. Thank you for coming back!

[word-vomity.livejournal.com]

For me honestly, I don't know. It is true that I am most often drawn to doomed ships, so I don't know that I've ever really engaged in a fandom for a ship that had a 'happy ending'. But . . . that's totally something I JUST realized about myself, so I'm not sure whether it's A. An unlucky coincidence or B. A compulsion for therapeutic editing of canon for my own psychological peace of mind, that drives me into all the traumatized fandoms.

Maybe it's because all the best shows shy away from easy black/white happy endings for their characters and I only watch the best shows and therefore ship for those ambiguously concluded shows. :D

Bottom line: I have no clue.

[onlyariana.livejournal.com]

I'm pretty new to BSG. I only watched the this spring. I'm not sure how I'll feel a year or several years from now. For right now though, I am just trying to fill up the craving that the show developed. From the mini there was the suggestion/promise that this ship was in the works. It really seems like that plan changed wildly somewhere along the line (not really sure where) but they never bothered to communicate that. So now it's like my best friend promised me her world famous chocolate cake and then I never got it. I'm searching for chocolate cake but because it doesn't come in the context I was expecting I continue to crave it. Fanfic and fandom discussions and all that are amazing but I still haven't gotten my promised pilot resolution so I'm still craving it.

Not sure if that actually makes sense or I'm just PMSing and craving sweets.

[word-vomity.livejournal.com]

"So now it's like my best friend promised me her world famous chocolate cake and then I never got it. I'm searching for chocolate cake"

Not sure if this makes sense?!?!?! I've never read anything that makes that much sense about our pilots! :) *cough* also PMSing *cough*

[daybreak777.livejournal.com]

I always thought pilots had an epic love story since . . . well, it always seemed from season one that these were the two to watch. And they were. :-) I like my ships to get happy endings. Dr. Quinn and Sully was a completely happily-ended ship and I adored every moment of it. :-D. Doug and Carol on ER had a rougher time but he came back for her in the end.

I even believe Rhett and Scarlett would have gotten back together if the author hadn't passed away before writing that sequel. I have eternal springing hope for my couples. :-D

And yes, if they had tried to downplay Kara and Lee after year one (they did, but I mean if they had whisked the principals completely off screen) they would still have an epic love story IN MY MIND. But funny, my unhappiness with the way the writers wrote K/L in season 2.5 did send me looking for K/L fanfic. And thus, to LJ. So I guess I should thank them?!

ETA: It's an interesting dilemma. A great and well-written (not necessarily 'happy' but I woulda taken happy) ending for Kara and Lee. But such satisfaction that might not lead me to fic or LJ. Or finding LJ because I was dissatisfied. I can't choose. I want them both. I want the well-written ending and LJ. :-)

[mserrada.livejournal.com]

I know I came to fandom because I wanted MOAR!
Sure, some of that was the lack of closure and the need to 'fix' things, but mostly I missed Pilots.

While I did do a 'poof'-fix fic, it has been the tiniest part of my own writing. So, I like to believe that I'd still be here today in any case and consorting with all ya super folks!

[winegums.livejournal.com]

So did I - when I finally, at long last, sat down and watched Daybreak, Part 1 and 2, the thing that I felt saddest about was that this was the last we'd ever see of these characters. Like you, I simply missed them - and probably missed them MORE because of the lack of resolution. But I'd have missed them either way.

It's just nice to see I wasn't alone in feeling like that.

[dannicawebb.livejournal.com]

this this this!

some of it for me is the need to fix things, definitely, but...i think even if pilots had had a happy ending i'd still be reading and writing fic because there can never be enough pilots in the world. i'd want ALL the happy endings. and the sad ones too. written in a million different ways.

[winegums.livejournal.com]

there can never be enough pilots in the world.

This is so, so true. And I just wanted to say, I really love your fic. Esp. Breeding Lilacs, it is GORGEOUS.