DPP: Go Fourth and Prosper

[callmeonetrack.livejournal.com]

 

Happy Independence Day, US peeps, and happy Wednesday everyone else!
Thought maybe we could muse on a few topics related to the holiday today:

Do you think pilots gave a lot of consideration to their work as being patriotic?
Was that a motivating factor for either of them, do you think, in choosing to join the service?
Where in the series do you think the idea of military being "doing your patriotic duty" comes up?
What about democracy and justice and all that good stuff? Clearly Lee's a democracy fan but what about Kara?

And finally, just for fun, two fic recs related to the holiday, sorta
(these are all I can think of, off the top of my head, but please feel free to leave more in the comments!) 
All Will Be Revealed (in which Lee strips as Captain Democracy!) by dionusia
Frak Democracy (in which Kara smudges Lee's constitution!) by taragel 
More Than Fireworks in the Sky (in which Lee sees fireworks thanks to Kara!) by sci_fi_shipper

Comments

[winegums.livejournal.com]

It's funny, even though the series bible says Kara is a patriot who gets teary over the Colonial anthem, she never struck me that way, at least not how she was written/how Katee played her. I think she sees the military as a sort of family-by-extension and her loyalties are to that, rather than to the idea of the Colonies as a political entity.

Same with Lee - he's devoted to the idea of democracy and good governance, but I think he's more about the systems than the Colonies that the systems are supposed to be upholding. I mean, wasn't he the one to suggest that the Fleet be reorganised on ship basis instead of planetary basis after the massacre of the Quorum?

[rachelindeed.livejournal.com]

wasn't he the one to suggest that the Fleet be reorganised on a ship basis instead of planetary basis

This is very random, but what you said reminded me of a story in Herodotus' Histories. He's describing the debates that took place before the Battle of Salamis in the Persian War. Basically, the Persians have finally succeeded in conquering Athens, and the Athenians abandon their city and retreat to their boats, along with their allies. Then they hold a council of war, and their allies vote to sail away to a safe part of the Greek peninsula and regroup. But a leading Athenian says they should make their stand and fight the Persians on the water then and there, in the straits of Salamis, with the hope of forcing them to withdraw.

One of their allies says, "Look, in case you haven't noticed, you don't have a country any more. And that means you don't get a vote in this council. Only countries are represented here. So maybe you should go find yourself a country and shut up until you do."

And the Athenian (Themistocles) says, "Actually, I think you'll find that as long as we Athenians have a fleet we have a country. And you might want to think about the fact that our fleet can sail us straight to your country and we can take it over whenever we feel like it. So you might want to think about voting the way I tell you to, you idiot."

The fleet fought at Salamis, and won :)

It may be just me, but that sounds like Kara's kind of politics.

(ETA: Sorry, I corrected it 'cause I realized I had mixed up which war it was all about!)

[winegums.livejournal.com]

Hmmm, possible. But I feel like we never really see Kara being particularly bothered about the Fleet outside of the military, I mean of course she risks her ass to get them to Earth and is ultimately obsessed with it, but I think that ultimately, her heart is with Galactica and its crew - people she deals with on a daily basis.

[rachelindeed.livejournal.com]

Sure, I agree. She works on personal loyalties more than anything. I imagine she cares about protecting the fleet/human survivors more than she cares about the political systems that define Lee's patriotism. I think she was off rescuing Sam during the only election in the show :)

[winegums.livejournal.com]

Yeah, and she framed it as 'we have a duty to our people', which....50 people? (ultimately more like 20 + a Cylon, lol). And it's not like we get to see Lee during that election either or his reaction to the results, even if his girlfriend was the one helping to steal it...

It's funny, neither of them strikes me as particularly patriotic about Caprica, is all. I mean, they never particularly seem to identify themselves that way, even when Lee takes up the Quorum post it's all about 'I want to be useful, and this is the way Zarek found for me to do it' rather than 'I'm repping my home', if you get what I mean.