DPP: Myths and Misconceptions
Mar. 27th, 2011 01:02 pm![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
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no_takebacksRelated to this, I think it's a huge misconception that Kara has trouble following orders. Yes, she gives Lee grief over shooting at the Olympic Carrier at first, but...she also fires immediately and when she gets the two worst orders ever: Adama telling her to execute Cain and Lee telling her to manually detonate bomb in Razor....she agrees to both, without hesitating.
Likewise, someone was saying on Twitter that they could never think of Lee as a killer...and yet he murdered Phelan in cold blood. Granted he had good reasons, but.... I mean he also is a soldier. He kills lots of people because it's his job. Related, the show itself insists that Lee is "too honorable to cheat" in EOJ/Rapture...and yet he cheated on Dee with Kara in UB and almost in Daybreak flashbacks, and clearly they're having hot makeouts in EOJ, which to me = cheating.
There's also, in fic often, the idea that Lee wants to talk about relationship issues and analyze things. And while sometimes in canon he does ask Kara to talk (Home, Scar), more often he refuses to talk about things, just bottles up or turns away.
Anyway, all of this just made me think about the other things that we assume about the characters and what they would/wouldn't do. About how sometimes you get ideas stuck in your head about the kind of person they must be, and you ignore later evidence that they've changed or can behave differently than you'd expect. I'm not sure what point any of this has, but....yeah...it's Sunday. It's rambly pilots meta. Have at it!
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Date: 2011-03-27 05:17 pm (UTC)And Kara does talk. Actually, I sometimes think Kara talks more about herself and her relationships with Lee and Sam more than Lee ever does. Lee keeps mum on the personal stuff. He never tells Adama how much he loved Kara, he never really told anyone about their relationship. At least Kara told Tigh (for what good it did them) and she talked to Helo about Sam. Maybe I'm forgetting (which is ENTIRELY possible), but when did Lee ever reveal thing about his feelings for Kara? (It's so funny to think that Kara is the talker and Lee is not!) Hell, even Sam and Kara talked about her feelings for Lee. I don't remember Lee ever admitting to Dee that he loved Kara.
In the end, they're both as terrified of the relationship as the other, although their fear comes at different points in the relationship. Kara can't enter into the relationship for her reasons and Lee can't resume the relationship after EoJ. Gah. The whole thing is so frustrating and infuriating and makes me feel really sad.
(Hee. I have matched your rambliness, Tara, with some mess Sunday thoughts, too.) :D:D
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Date: 2011-03-28 12:34 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-04-12 08:48 am (UTC)I guess that for a lot of us his feelings are more transparent than hers but YES, he didn't spoke about them to people, not really.
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Date: 2011-03-27 05:22 pm (UTC)Like, Starbuck's cocky demeanor tends to promote the notion that she doesn't make excuses or acknowledge mistakes, but just like you said, she does under certain circumstances. I think one or several fanfic writers tend to latch on to the general attitude and push it to be a hard-line rule for the character. Then others, reading the fics, propagate it in their own writing and it just kind of flourishes into an accepted assumptions.
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Date: 2011-03-28 12:36 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-04-12 08:46 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-03-27 05:36 pm (UTC)Sort of tied to this, Kara is in generally a lot more loyal to their friendship (if not their romance) than Lee is. She unquestioningly has his back, where Lee often stands back to see where things lie before making his move.
...This sounds like a condemnation of Lee, but it's not. I love the character a lot. He's just not Saint Lee.
And this one is a fic pet-peeve. I get why it happens, I get how it works, but it really drives me crazy when authors present "Starbuck" and "Kara" as essentially different characters. (It happens with Lee/Apollo, too, but it isn't nearly as prevalent.
And that is my two page essay of thinky thoughts for a rainy Sunday.
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Date: 2011-03-27 07:12 pm (UTC)Ooh, this is an interesting observation. I never really thought about this before.
Do you think it's because (again, against gender stereotype), Lee has a much harder time compartmentalizing things than Kara does? She can separate what's going on romantically between them from their friendship, and it's terribly obvious where that unnatural ability to contain relational pain, so completely, comes from. And she has all these venting mechanisms to deal with it, which is why she's so messy on the outside. Whereas Lee keeps EVERYTHING inside, contained in one seething mess that never sees the light of day except in extraordinary circumstances.
Maybe I'm just trying to make a case for his loyalty, because I've always seen him that way (not that I think he's St Lee, either). To me, he just doesn't have ANY coping mechanism for the pain that comes his way except to absorb and bottle, and so he can't get past the romantic pain with Kara when the friendship would need him to. And why he takes longer to assess the situation; he can't blow off the consequences at all, compared to Kara who can, to SOME extent at least. And who is vastly more comfortable with relational fallout than Lee is. I don't know, I'm kind of thinking out loud here. Is it making sense?
it really drives me crazy when authors present "Starbuck" and "Kara" as essentially different characters.
ITA. It's a poor grasp of the complexities of her character. Grrr.
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Date: 2011-03-27 07:27 pm (UTC)I definitely think Kara's relationship to Lee has a lot to do with compartmentalization. And stubbornness. She wants an involvement in his life, whether or not it's deserved. She's willing to take what she can get, where Lee is a bit more discerning. (He thinks) he'd rather not have Kara than have a married-girlfriend/best friend.
I also suspect that a big component of this dynamic is Kara's forgiveness thing. Not that all of her issues are (well deserved) mommy-issues, but, I think because NO ONE is ever going to manage to hurt and betray Kara quite the way her mother did, she doesn't really need to hold grudges. On the other hand, Lee's method of self-protection seems to be more a tally of "hurts" vs. "helps" and sometimes the scale for Kara leans in the "hurt" direction.
Ugh. Such great characters. I feel like this conversation could go on for years!
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Date: 2011-03-27 08:08 pm (UTC)So true! I agree that with the people she loves, Kara is forgiving because she is so conditioned to blame herself if things go wrong (as opposed to being content to blame others she is not too close with for their shortcomings--a la Tigh being a superior asshole, etc.). I think that's all the internalized abuse from Momma Socrata.
Lee does seem more of a score keeper too. Hmm.
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Date: 2011-03-27 11:54 pm (UTC)I feel like this conversation could go on for years!
:)
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Date: 2011-03-31 01:28 am (UTC)Yeah he's really bitter about Kara after New Caprica and it's hard for him to open himself up to her again. I personally loved that the show went there and paradoxically I was convinced only by Kara's actions there that she loved Lee but I can't blame him for being reluctant to lay his feelings on the line again after that. I would NEVER forgive someone who did that to me, ever.
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Date: 2011-03-31 03:25 am (UTC)It's more that my read on Lee is that he may well forgive slights (perceived or otherwise), but he does remember them and that he makes an accounting of sorts about people's trustworthiness from this.
Honestly, it's the smarter and more logical approach, but it isn't the fanon characterization of Pushover Saint Lee that sometimes crops up in fic.
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Date: 2011-04-12 01:33 pm (UTC)Yeah he's really bitter about Kara after New Caprica and it's hard for him to open himself up to her again. I personally loved that the show went there and paradoxically I was convinced only by Kara's actions there that she loved Lee but I can't blame him for being reluctant to lay his feelings on the line again after that. I would NEVER forgive someone who did that to me, ever.
i like this line of thinking because i'm there with you on the never forgiving somebody for something like that. i was actually surprised that he went passed that and open up to her in that way. i think that maybe without the whole fight with Sam in EoJ/Rapture he would have acted a lot different after what he saw as a new rejection.
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Date: 2011-03-27 05:47 pm (UTC)One misconception I see alot about Lee is that he is an atheist. More accurately he is an agnostic. In KLG (DS) Roslin asks him to go back for arrow of Apollo. He believes there is something to what she is saying, but wouldn't go cause it's not his call to make. I think especially by the end of the run, he believes there's something out there. Wouldn't label it the LoK or the cylon god, but there's something.
You are right people tend to oversell Lee's willingness to talk and undersell Kara's willingness to talk. There have been times where one or the other has wanted to talk and the shot them down or shut them out. Home I Kara shut out Lee. TAB Lee shut out Kara. Epiphanies again Lee brushes off Kara. In AoC (DS) Kara shoots down Lee. Anyway I could go on and on, but bottom line to say one is more willing to talk about their relationship is just not true. Just look at how they handled their spouses. When K&S or L&D talked about their relationships show me one time where Sam or Dee didn't initiate it somehow?
However even though they didn't do well in talking about their relationship, I think they talked about things alot more then people they they did. All because they didn't show it, doesn't mean it didn't happen. Razor at the end Kara jokes with Lee about her "destiny". Never saw them talk about that, but they did. In SaGN when she found her body and got back to the fleet, she went to Lee to talk about it. The fact she would do that, speaks volumes about how much they do communicate. Now not saying they tell each other every little thing that has happened with each other, but they know alot more than I think the average fan think they do.
I think they talked quite a bit about things that happened to them, but did a poor job talking about their relationship. Also I don't think one was really better than the other in this dept.
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Date: 2011-03-27 08:10 pm (UTC)I do like how much could have happened between them "off the screen" and any references to that in canon kind of delight me. I remmber being shocked, yet pleased that Kara referenced "the dollhouse" and Leoben like Lee knew all that happened at the start of Revelations.
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Date: 2011-03-27 08:38 pm (UTC)Though sometimes I think this is a good thing. Considering how it turned out, do we want them writing their full detailed story? I don't think so.
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Date: 2011-03-28 01:15 pm (UTC)Haha. That would be an excerise in unnecessary cruelty.
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Date: 2011-03-27 06:43 pm (UTC)no subject
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Date: 2011-03-27 08:11 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-03-27 08:26 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-04-12 01:37 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-04-12 04:11 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-03-27 06:45 pm (UTC)Sadly, not having been in the fandom long (and that time mostly spent splashing around in this here puddle), I actually don't have much of an idea of the misconceptions that are prevalent. I don't seek out much fic for just this reason, actually – I see people writing the characters in ways that just don't make sense to me, and I don't care how interesting your plot idea is, if you've gone OOC, I'm not giving it the time of day. I'm kind of, er, picky, I guess.
I totally agree that Lee's a killer. I guess the problem some people associate some kind of enjoyment of killing with that term, but really all it means is a willingness to take human life. Lee never, ever does it lightly or without an appreciation for the cost and implications, but he is still willing where he deems it necessary. Surely that's an inescapable trait in a soldier, as you point out.
The honourable/cheating thing is a bit more snarly, and I think it all comes down to what constitutes cheating for people. Clearly, there's some kind of justification going on with the idea that cheating is really only Cheating if it's done in the context of a marriage, since neither of them were married in the flashback in UB, and that actual sex is the defining point of Cheating. That, or Lee didn't consider the UB sex cheating because from the moment it began, he had mentally already left Dee and committed himself to Kara. Mind you, I'm not saying that I think it's justifiable, but that this is how Lee (and maybe the show, I can't actually tell where it comes down on this question) can try to justify it to himself.
If we're trying to reconcile the honourable/cheating thing, the Daybreak flashbacks require a lot more justification. Although I think you CAN make sense of it within the given boundaries of his character, I don't think it can be actually justified in any way. And clearly Lee can't either, because the guilt of it is still present in how he interacts with Kara in the early seasons. Perhaps the honourable trait isn't so much not doing it, but recognising how wrong it was? Snarly, snarly.
Although it brings up another question for me: how promiscuous do we generally think Kara was? Clearly her encounters with Lee were atypical for her, just in the fact that it was LEE. But beyond that, most our information about her behaviour comes from the men she hurt the most with it, Sam and Lee, who I don't consider 100% reliable narrators. So is there a fanon consensus on the extent of her "catting around", and does that reflect what's actually shown on the show?
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Date: 2011-03-27 08:16 pm (UTC)Honestly...I could easily see Kara cheating on Sam on New Caprica. If the novelty wore off... if she was feeling claustrophobic... if she'd gone on a bender of sorts. She mostly treated him casually and with disregard when we saw them together. However, I disregard the way the flashbacks happen because I don't think she would've attempted to cheat on Zak in such a casual way, even drunk and in the heat of the moment, EVEN WITH LEE, so... I draw my own boundaries too I guess. ;)
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Date: 2011-03-27 11:44 pm (UTC)Interesting that Katee and Trucco both think Sam was making it up. I think he certainly exaggerated it in order to hurt Lee, but I lean more your direction, that she quite likely did cheat to some extent. That line specifically, "You're not the first," struck me from a dramatic irony perspective, because I tend to think Lee WAS the first, even though Sam didn't know it. That Kara partially hated what she'd done in marrying Sam, specifically to Lee, and therefore slept around on Sam somewhat – but it was all because Lee was the first! And I'd put money on the notion that, like with Baltar, she was mentally and emotionally with Lee when she cheated, even though she couldn't be with him physically. Which was intensified by the deterioration of their relationship until they reconciled. None of that seems OOC for her to me.
With Zak, though, I agree with you that Kara as we know her now – even as she was at the beginning of the series – wouldn't have attempted it. But I can conceive that being the result of character growth, which partially came out of that time. I mean, say that she went through plenty of guys but was never in a serious relationship until Zak came along (and being the loyal person she is, I can totally see the first serious relationship she ever gets in becoming the one she thinks is forever). That she was therefore faithful to him, and that hadn't been seriously tested before Lee, and she was therefore unaware of her capacity to cheat. That the booze and the chemistry and the everything triggered the old instincts for sex, but even more powerfully combined with the newly-formed appreciation for relationship being tantalized by the unique connection that was between them. That many of the warning signs that would later make this sort of thing a conscious decision weren't set up yet, because she'd never done it before.
So, I don't know. I wasn't terribly shocked by the table scene, but then I hadn't spent however many years in fandom and fic that laid out their relationship pre-mini, so I hadn't built up much expectation of what that looked like. I also hadn't invested as much in their OTP relationship at that point, or at least hadn't noticed that I'd formed that expectation until the *poof* revealled myself to me, and so my own cheating!squick didn't kick in nearly as much.
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Date: 2011-03-28 11:43 am (UTC)Without affronting anyone, hopefully, I think that the fandom's rejection of this portrayal of Kara has more to do with what fans want Kara to be, than any particularly strong evidence in canon. Whether it's because fans relate really closely to the character and project some kind of self-image, or because they just have some deep moral discomfort with it, I don't know.
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Date: 2011-03-28 12:09 pm (UTC)However, it's mostly the execution of it, because it was played for a sporting, casual kind of thing even though the idea behind it was that they were so instantly besotted with each other that they forgot everything else around them. So if the producers had had the balls to go there and make it a really flat-out romantic, I can't keep my hands off you sort of thing, which I think they were going towards with all the confessions--however misguided--about deepest fears and all that close-talking, smiling, flirting in the flashback scene BEFORE she's patting the table and saying "RIGHT NOW. JUST DO ME. I DARE YOU."...well, then for me, it would've been a different story. It's the change in gears because the producers loved the idea (as they say in their podcast) that this was a challenge between jocks or some such nonsense that doesn't work for me at all.
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Date: 2011-03-28 01:09 pm (UTC)Yeah, I found the whole almost-frak on the table in DB2 pretty ridiculous, if only because Zak was still in the room! I probably would have bought K&L getting busy while Zak was alive if there had been some kind of undeniable attraction reasoning developed, but to show it as such a casual matter seems to fly in the face of logic, let alone character traits. I find it hard to believe that, even really drunk, they'd be prepared to blatantly do it on a table with Zak present (even if he was passed out). The most basic drunken cost-benefit analysis should tell any sane adult that that's likely to end badly. It's just stupidity!
And if RDM&Co wanted it as a challenge between jocks, they didn't do a very good job of setting up a competitive, one-up-manship atmosphere. You're absolutely right about the confessions and fears being totally out of step with the subsequent challenge.
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Date: 2011-03-28 05:09 pm (UTC)Ooh, link? I like to read the back-and-forths, it helps me sort through what I understand, too. I think I've already said it somewhere, but I haven't really nailed down that much of my "read" of these characters, particularly their relationship. I'm still feeling my way, and haven't watched the series THAT much that I can recall the pertinent details easily, so this kind of discussion really helps with that.
I'll qualify what I meant with RDM: there's a difference between "frakked around a lot" (ie, was consistently unfaithful), and having episodes of infidelity. I'm not willing yet to put her in the box of just casually sleeping with anyone anytime she feels like it when she's already in a committed relationship. Outside of that kind of relationship, yeah, I don't see any inconsistency in that portrayal of her, and it makes total sense of what I know of her. But once she's in a relationship – Zak, and then Sam once she got him back from Caprica – I read it as needing a tipping point before she'll resume that pattern. Both times it was Lee, too, but whatever. So I think she was faithful to Sam once she got him back, up to being with Lee in UB, after which she probably started cheating on Sam whenever the guilt or whatever needed to be blown off. Not knowing the timelines pre-mini, I'm curious about what pattern she settled into after meeting Lee. I don't remember – did she pass Zak before or after meeting Lee?
fandom's rejection of this portrayal of Kara has more to do with what fans want Kara to be, than any particularly strong evidence in canon
Ah, well, that's fandom generally, isn't it? Too true. As much as we all at times complain that they're not telling the story right in some way, it should be acknowledged that it's their story to tell, not ours. Sure, they screw things up, but determining what the story is is up to the storyteller. Which is a really annoying conviction to have, because I can't turn canon off when writing fic. :(
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Date: 2012-12-01 05:04 am (UTC)This is kind of how I see it. That Kara, at that point in time, could have done this. The Kara we meet in the mini is at least two years older, and wiser relationship-wise than that open, happy person we see in the flashbacks.
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Date: 2011-04-12 02:08 pm (UTC)but yes, it's a matter of personal opinion/boundaries/views if you consider that cheating or not (and killing for that matter). for me it is cheating but on another level than like i was saying the constant lie. i mean, i could forgive that (mainly because at the end of the day it is not faithful but it is honest), but not what Kara suggested in EoJ.
the flashback is harder but being laid on us out of the context we can not say. maybe at that point he was not yet the man that we know (and she was not he woman that we know) or maybe he would have did something to make amends. and we do know that the guilt is there.
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Date: 2011-03-27 07:21 pm (UTC)Somewhat off topic ramble (because, of course, this is me...)
Date: 2011-03-28 12:34 am (UTC)So what does this all mean for me?
It means that if a writer has a very different approach to either character than I do, then I have difficulty "buying" their writing. Does it mean that their interpretation is wrong? Absolutely not. Just that it doesn't fit within my construct of the characters. And I admit that this is absolutely true for me as well. A truly exception and well-respected fandom author once asked me why 'my Kara' cried as often as she did. That trait was pulling her out of my writing. And the answer is, that this is how she appears through my lens. And so, unless this happens to fit within your own particular view, it will always seem out of character, even if there are examples in canon of it occuring.
Re: Somewhat off topic ramble (because, of course, this is me...)
Date: 2011-03-28 12:51 am (UTC)OMGs, I could not for the life of me figure out how to saw this early. Thank you! <3
I think part of the reason fanfic in this fandom appeals to me so much is the wide variety of interpretations that still feel correct to me. Part of the beauty of Lee and Kara as characters is that they are rich and deep. This is going to include inconsistencies and odd moment that don't fit, but everyone has those, good characters should too.
Re: Somewhat off topic ramble (because, of course, this is me...)
Date: 2011-03-28 04:03 am (UTC)This is very much what I love about the whole fanfic phenomenon. There are so many aspects to explore which makes it wso wonderful to both write and to read. :>)
Re: Somewhat off topic ramble (because, of course, this is me...)
Date: 2011-03-28 02:50 am (UTC)This is my interpretation as well. And as you pointed out, the characters changed so much (and so dynamically/erratically) over the course of the series that as long as the fic takes off from the right point in canon, I can accept most interpretations. Everything from your relatively externally emotional Kara to
For example, the Lee I write in Echoes is unswervingly committed to the relationship he and Kara share. He has no doubts, and no questions. Because he grew out of a version of that night on New Caprica that ended with Kara staying. He put it all out on the line that night and it paid off, so why would he doubt or question his choice there. She's the one for him, and she stayed so he's going to be damned if he's going to let her go. He can take a little extra turbulence without falling into a desperate bout of Leemo. Jumping from a different place, where he didn't have that particular history, wouldn't have allowed him the confidence to be the way he is in that particular story.
Re: Somewhat off topic ramble (because, of course, this is me...)
Date: 2011-03-28 04:08 am (UTC)Incidentally, I find S1 Kara to be the most challenging to write. And since I've admitted my propensity to write her as more emotionally vulnerable, this probably makes sense. :>D
Re: (Yeah, totally off topic.)
Date: 2011-03-28 04:34 am (UTC)Flattered, really, but don't fret too much. I need to make a Writing In Progress/Complaint post at some point soon, but the short version is that given the constraints of my life and the reality of what I'm working with at this point, there's probably still another year to go before the thing is finished. **sigh**
Re: Somewhat off topic ramble (because, of course, this is me...)
Date: 2011-03-28 04:32 am (UTC)I see this point as the key to almost all successful writing/writers. Period. Although the fact that Kara and Lee are so complex and draw complex individuals to them may explain why K/L fanfic (and bsg fanfic in general) is often so far above "typical" fanfic quality. You've gotta be kinda crazy smart, intuitive, and thoughtful/speculative to live in the bsg world...canon and fanon.
Also, with this:
It means that if a writer has a very different approach to either character than I do, then I have difficulty "buying" their writing. Does it mean that their interpretation is wrong? Absolutely not. Just that it doesn't fit within my construct of the characters.
I think you could replace "character" with "life" and have that paragraph be a very wise commentary on fic in general. My best examples are Hemingway and Kundera. Now I love Hemingway but it took reading him during one of my depressed periods to move from feeling bogged down by his work and frustrated by his sentence structure to absolutely loving the way he creates that palpable heaviness. I had to be at a point where I could appreciate that sentiment before I could fully "buy it". Same with fitting in our "life constructs". I used to HATE Kundera because his permissive tone and facility with polyamory left me hurt and angry. Now that my own paradigm is more accepting of poly instead of being so rabidly defensive of monogamy, his work is way more fun.
Anyhow, enough babbling in agreement. The key point is that I think the fact you "get" these points clearly enough to write them down so concisely is part of your strength as a writer. ♥
Re: Somewhat off topic ramble (because, of course, this is me...)
Date: 2011-03-28 01:34 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-03-28 01:21 am (UTC)Most of you know that I went on a crazy reading rampage when I first got into fandom. What I came to realize is that after reading so many stories in such a short time and not having seen the series enough times (most episodes twice at most), canon and fanon have gotten blurry in my head. And I expect I am not the only one. I know I mentioned this on another post (http://community.livejournal.com/no_takebacks/159305.html?thread=8521033#t8521033) recently with the specific example of the black market storyline. I must not be the only one for whom aired versus deleted scenes versus fanfic are blurring together. Especially with the heaps of missing scene fics floating around.. My point is this is probably how misperceptions become part of our own canon especially when assigning behavioral patterns to characters.
If there is ever a crowd that won't laugh at this admission this is it, so here's the story of my Sunday afternoon: I've been spending this rainy afternoon going through all my bsg fanfic bookmarks in delicious, organizing and annotating them. But more importantly I've been observing my own patterns, trends that highlight my own kinks and authors whose stories I consistently marked as favorites and their commonalities. I've been contemplating once again why I love these two characters as much as I do. There is a post about tragic love that's been percolating in my head for some time now. Perhaps I'll get to it this afternoon.
Hugs to you all. Hope you are having an enjoyably contemplative Sunday like me.
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Date: 2011-03-28 01:39 am (UTC)For example: I've seen how people hate on Lee because of how he treated Dee, but they forgive instantly how Kara treated Sam. Or how they think that Lee is more emotional than Kara and I never saw it that way. Since every decision Kara ever made was based on emotion. Lee was the thinker where Kara was the doer.
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Date: 2011-03-28 03:12 am (UTC)**raises hand** Guilty as charged! Here's where it comes from, for me.
Kara has a handful of friends, or at least people she's connected to emotionally. She knew them from before the end of the worlds, or she made a positive emotional connection to them at some point during the series, and so is able to let them inside a little bit.
Lee never had that. He kidded with a few people. He had something with Dee, but it was certainly did not have the depth that his relationship with Kara had. So, I want him to be able to talk to someone, to sort through the emotional whatever of what all is going on, and the only person it makes any kind of sense for him to turn to is... Kara. So in my head, he wants to talk to her about his feeeeeelings.
**blush**
Anyways, mostly this just is to reinforce
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Date: 2011-03-28 12:54 pm (UTC)Is Kara insubordinate?
Well, I'd say, at fundamental level, yes.
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Date: 2011-03-28 05:26 pm (UTC)However, I'd say that regardless of how she feels about heirarchies, she desperately needs them. She is not good at functioning on her own authority – she needs some kind of structure to react against, whether positively or negatively. She's lost without it, whereas Lee is better at forging ahead on his own authority. It takes her dying, finding earth and coming back to put her on a path that doesn't take it's direction from any of the authority figures in her life, and from a certain perspective even then she's operating under the authority of her Very Special Destiny.
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Date: 2011-03-28 07:18 pm (UTC)It's surprising to me how often fanon suggests that she doesn't follow Lee's orders though. I'd bet she follows his most of all. (In fact, if I can ever get done with remix and ice!pilots, that D/s club on Cloud 9 fic will give proof to that theory. ;)